Team Everything Happens. Kate Bowler:Theres this other phrase, I was wrong, that has real power, and you learned that in a really intense way when your grandma died. I was also living only maybe 10 miles from my very old grandma who lived alone, and I kept kind of meaning to go visit her, but its a lot easier to show up at work every day at the United Way, and get kind of righteous about all the people who work for money versus the rest of us who are working for the greater good, than it is to go to your grandmas smelly, weird apartment, and have weird conversations with an 88-year old, you know? Our guest is Kelly Corrigan, a best-selling author and host of PBS talk show Tell Me More and podcast Kelly Corrigan Wonders. Kate Bowler:Yeah. Its cancer inflammatory breast cancer, with a twenty percent chance of living to five years. The idea that any day could be this huge day, I dont know, that really gets me out of bed, you know? Welcome to Kelly Corrigan Wonders, a place for people who like to laugh while they think and find it useful to look closely at ourselves and our weird ways in the hopes that knowing more and feeling more will help us do more and be better. Our family motto is, We dont sell family. When our dog was a puppy and being housebroken, he kept sneaking around piddling in the corners of rooms. Onwards, but you use it so beautifully when youre talking about Lizs family and how they are now. We should thank the chef. Kate Bowler:Well, I accept. She had ovarian cancer, so she had fought it for seven years, and it was the kind of thing where I felt like I urgently wanted to deserve my life. Hosted by four-time New York Times bestselling author Kelly Corrigan, the show dives deep into each guests life to pull out poignant lessons they hope others can use to find their own calling or better understand themselves. I think we should be talking about five percent of the time. Kate Bowler:Well I think part of it, and this gets to another phrase that you write about which is I dont know, but you and I, it sounds like, have given up on certainties as a way to cope with that, both having been through cancer, and also I think both realizing that people really dont like it when you say, I dont know.. The idea that any day could be this huge day, I dont know, that really gets me out of bed, you know? Shed do dishes all day and into the night to just get to listen to her children, just to get to watch them through a one-way glass, you know? It was the very last thing that I wrote, and you may be able to relate to this, theres always one part of a book that writes itself, at least for me, where its like, I guess Ive been thinking about this long enough, I guess Ive been living this long enough that its all kind of been subconsciously forming, and now Im just about taking dictation here, and thats the way that was. Ive read Tell Me More twice already. Today, Im speaking with New York Times bestselling author, Kelly Corrigan. Despair defies description. Kate Bowler:Todays episode is brought to you by our partners, North Carolina Public Radio WUNC, the Lilly Endowment, The Issachar Fund, The John Templeton Foundation, Faith and Leadership: An Online Learning Resource, and Duke Divinity School, and of course, Beverly Abel, Jessica Richie, and Be the Change Revolutions. They reel and wander and fixate and roll back and reconsider, because its like this, having a mind. One of the hardest things Ive been wrestling with is not having any clear language for this weird place between sick and healthy, weak and strong. The idea that we just sort of wander around, consume things until we die, like were just a series of small appetites without any deep, rich, meaningful, satisfying connection. Kate Bowler:Well, your book has such a wonderful collection of phrases around essays, stuff like Tell me more, and you write about incredible things people can say when theyre figuring out the road ahead. Kelly Corrigan:Thanks. Its a very learned thing that I have to insert the words into my mouth, and push them out deliberately, because my instinct is to solve. Kate Bowler:You and I are super chatty people, but you make an amazing pitch for silence, and I am all for it, because everyone always had these go-to things to say with me like, You can do it, or Youre so brave, and all the things that made me feel like I was on the other side of plexiglass. I didnt make her final days one bit better, and I lived there for two years. Its probably cause of something youve been eating. Kilpy We only book nice people who have a sense of humor and know things worth knowing. Minds dont rest. Kelly Corrigan:You know, that I had lost his favor for a moment, and I was just so ashamed. So, I really appreciated the way that you framed the bigness and the smallness of it, because it has to be both. Dalai Lama XIV, Cheryl, Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. Im hearing all the music, Im totally tuned in to the right channel, and then just like that, I slip into those mundane irritants., Kelly Corrigan:And then I catch myself, and then I feel this sense of shame, and he said, Its like this. My son was, of course, distraught and felt the dog was a part of the family and worth the trouble. Kelly Corrigan:I never came up with any combination that came close to the feeling. After the potency of the crime metaphor wore off, I turned to the vocabulary of religion. I was wrong, and that is very soothing, but then that took me back to this moment where I had gone to work for United Way after college, because I was going to save the world, and I was this total do-gooder. Kilpy Thank You for all you do!! I mean, its a little bit like, Just keep saying yes. You know, When in doubt, say Sure, Ill do that, just to see what happens next, just to see who you might meet. Gratefully, Mahra:Ive been singing these lines from a song by the Avett Brothers to my kids for years, and it goes like this. Its remarkable to hear a bit of your story and Im really grateful that youve shared it with us. We had several hamsters in one cage, and they can be cannibalistic, and one morning a hamster was missing, and another hamster had a suspiciously large tummy. Tell Me More with Kelly Corrigan is a series that inspires, educates and entertains. So, I grew up with this sentence with my fathers voice in my head saying, Allah Kareem, God is generous., Cheryl:Our family motto is, Dont eat a hamster. I was healthy, and then I was sick, and now Im feeling pretty good, and even though the language around immunotherapy isnt perfect, I can happily say that I am in remission. I guess everybody here, these children of mine and my husband, are just too damn busy to get on this, but Im not, so Ill do it, and then I was finishing, and I found a little pile of cut toenails on my kitchen table, and that. I think earn is such a good word, because youre talking about such a complicated math. For what Ive just seen in the last six months, I should be different. -Kilpy Thanks for sharing. All moments, days, chapters are transitory and the good ones leave us as do the bad ones. For awhile, Id say shed been robbed, or ripped off. Kelly reads everything from eulogies to retirement speeches and on February 19th, she . So, I kind of wondered if there was a motto youd pick for you for right now, what would it be? I was wrong not to try to ease her days in some way.. She totally doesnt get it. Were jumping in way too soon and talking way too much. Now, eleven years post-cancer, Im still learning to show up and be of use in my life, my marriage, my family and my work for the display of His splendor. Maybe you want to borrow one of Kellys like, Its like this, but youre totally welcome to borrow my familys motto: Dont let the turkeys get you down. Its tried and true. Weeks later, the missing hamster crawled out from under the stove. I thoroughly enjoyed your podcast and listening to you both. Kelly Corrigan. Is this how you would have cared for my son?, and you end up fixating on all of these tiny little things, and at the same time, so overwhelmed by not being sure if its trivial or tragic. Just get in the mix, get in the line of fire. Kelly Corrigan:Hearts dont idle. Many of you listen to Kelly Corrigan who WFS brought to Charlotte in October 2021. It was the very last thing that I wrote, and you may be able to relate to this, theres always one part of a book that writes itself, at least for me, where its like, I guess Ive been thinking about this long enough, I guess Ive been living this long enough that its all kind of been subconsciously forming, and now Im just about taking dictation here, and thats the way that was. But I asked the doctor what the right term for me might be, and he said Survivor-in-progress, which was super annoying. Ill definitely have to write this one down and bring it out on a particularly overwhelming day! Kelly Corrigan:Im telling you what, man, you can not believe how much I use this, and you can not believe how still it is not my natural instinct. Kelly Corrigan:So, I say at the end of this chapter, Shouldnt loss change a person for the better? Okay, great. Its these seemingly trivial moments. And you know, it was so weird, but dying was the easier part of it. Corrigan, a New York Times bestselling author, gives her Brief But Spectacular take on the power of words. I didnt do it. Kelly Corrigan:And I should not lose my mind over a shirt I bought on final sale section that didnt fit even though I tried to pull it over myself, and then it got stuck on me, and I had to cut it off with scissors. Kindly, Thanks For Being Here Mary Hope's Letter Introducing Alex. Stay healthy. Find me online at @KateCBowler, and Id love to hear what you think of this episode. The voice memos at the end of the episode are from listeners like you! I mean, that was my big experience of your book. Its the title of my memoir-still-in-progress. The reach of language can be laughable.. Alex, Im Kate Bowler, and this is Everything Happens. I was in a big, big rush to get in front of him, and say my apology, and be returned to a state of grace, but the fact is that his mom died. Her memoirs include " The Middle Place," and her first children's. Kelly Corrigan:You dont always need such a plan, or an agenda, or whatever. I should not be mad about this. Ill read you a little bit from the very end of that chapter because the thing that he was saying I think is, This is how it goes.. Kelly Corrigan:Thats not a headline anybody wants to read. Team Everything Happens. I loved this episode! Kelly Corrigan:You dont always need such a plan, or an agenda, or whatever. By creating an account, you acknowledge that PBS may share your information with our member stations and our respective service providers, and that you have read and understand the Privacy Policy and Terms of Use. And you know, it was so weird, but dying was the easier part of it. Kelly Corrigan:Have you ever heard that potted plant theory? Kate Bowler:Theres this other phrase, I was wrong, that has real power, and you learned that in a really intense way when your grandma died. The idea that we just sort of wander around, consume things until we die, like were just a series of small appetites without any deep, rich, meaningful, satisfying connection. Id love to hear more about what this means to you. Team Everything Happens. Shes not going to their wedding, shes not going to pick out wedding dresses with them. Kelly Corrigan:Like, Oh, well we still have sex, so were definitely not going to get a divorce, or you know, Oh my husband doesnt travel, so then were definitely not gonna get a divorce, or you know, I never smoked cigarettes, so Im definitely not going to get breast cancer. Simply becauseIts like this or, my current favorite: Its a species behavior., Nan, You cant only experience deep gratitude at the toenails that you seriously wish someone else would have cut, because seriously, whos doing this around here? You say something thats so weird cause I say it all the time, so when I read it I thought, Did you reach inside my brain? You adopted the phrase, Onward as a bit of a motto. Follow Kate on Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook. They reel and wander and fixate and roll back and reconsider, because its like this, having a mind. Kate Bowler:Words matter. Mary Hope wrote this thoughtful, open-hearted letter to her community to introduce her son Alex - who had previously been known to all as Jenna, her daughter. So now if a family member is being difficult or misbehaving, we have established ground rules, So and so is family and we dont sell family! Kelly Corrigan:She cant wear half her clothes because she cant zip them by herself. Teri Rose wrote this loving remembrance of her son Ryland. Kelly Corrigan:Sure, my pleasure. I had to make it into a vest to remove it from my body with the tag still on it, you know? Kelly Corrigan:And so I didnt do it. Kelly Corrigan:Well, chop-chop kid. Im so grateful to hear the ways youre connecting with Kate and Kelly. If you love the episode, please share and review. Welcome to Kelly Corrigan Wonders, a place for people who like to laugh while they think and find it useful to look closely at ourselves and our weird ways in the hopes that knowing more and feeling more will help us do more and be better. Dont worry, and she said, Well, my problem is I cant zip my dress by myself, so I thought if it was a woman, I could ask her to come in, and zip my dress, and I thought, Thats the tiny moments that are so gut-wrenching for a new widow. Dont misread this, my mother was a loving woman, but she passed on this legacy, this painful legacy shed been burdened with, that women should take up as little space as possible, risk as little as possible, and hide our lights lest we make fools of ourselves. In other words, it could happen to you tomorrow.. Im like, Yeah, right. And then right on the heels of that, I think, What would Liz do for this?. Ask anyone who has participated in a moment of silence. Were just a series of days and interactions. Gratefully, Theres a whole world out there happening, and you can step into all kinds of things, and you dont need to know why youre leaving the house. Kelly Corrigan:I mean, thats where it is. Kelly Corrigan:So, I had to wait, and then finally we had a window, and I said, I was wrong. I really appreciate it. I was in a big, big rush to get in front of him, and say my apology, and be returned to a state of grace, but the fact is that his mom died. Thats where relationship lives is in these tiny moments, and whether you are cognizant of that and tuned into that channel all the time, or not, that is the story of a relationship. Forever? Maya Shankars Plus One is Christy Warren, a former first responder with 25 years of experience in the field. It just ends the tension because what youre saying is, I see it how you see it, and I agree with you. Yeah. Kelly Corrigan:Hearts dont idle. Okay, great. You've just tried to add this show to My List. Kate Bowler:I need to hear what your motto is. Kelly Corrigan:So, I get it, but I spend a lot of time with them, and Im madly in love with them, really, really have this deep, incredible connection with them that I just value so much, and they are in her, and you know, theyre everything that was so important to her. Like the other day when I was being wheeled into a procedure, the nurse looked at my chart, and then casually said, Colon cancer. I mean, I dont know why you went with, Everything Happens for a Reason, because Dont get crumbs on the baby, that could be the follow up. I found that instructive. Kelly shares her own go to mantra as well as two blessings from frequent Kelly Corrigan Wonders guest Kate Bowler and her co-author/friend/podcast producer Jessica Richies beautiful and extremely useful book: The Lives We Actually Have (100 Blessings for Imperfect Days). What do we do when the labels were given arent necessarily the ones we choose for ourselves? I think part of why your book is so moving is the way that these sayings crystallize these really big truths about who we are, and also how we should love each other. Each episode ends with a special Plus One segment, in which guests are invited to thank those that have supported them along their journey. Yeah. The reach of language can be laughable.. Duration: 3:0 Transcript HARI SREENIVASAN: Now to another in our Brief But Spectacular. For a special listener who was just diagnosed, here are some thoughts on the stages of recovery that I encourage you to share with every last person you know who is in treatment for anything. Kelly Corrigan:I know, me too. Its what I said to my grad school colleague when she asked me if I planned to go into academia after we graduated. In other words, it could happen to you tomorrow.. Kelly Corrigan:Theyre never going to not do that, and thats how theyre going to raise their kids, and that means shes still here. Kelly Corrigan:My instinct is to fix, cause I feel Im almost sure I can. Thank you for helping me think more deeply about my words; not just the words I speak to others but the words I speak to myself. Kelly Corrigan Wonders on Apple Podcasts 296 episodes Welcome to Kelly Corrigan Wonders, a place for people who like to laugh while they think and find it useful to look closely at ourselves and our weird ways in the hopes that knowing more and feeling more will help us do more and be better. Kate Bowler:Yeah, yeah, yeah. And the potted plant theory, I cant credit it to someone, Im sorry, I dont know who put it out there, but the idea is that if you were to have a plant in your kitchen, you might not be aware of it at all, and then if someone were to remove it, youd say What happened to that plant?. Yeah. Ask the dancers, and the athletes, the painters, and musicians. Shes not going to hold their babies.. Kelly Corrigan Full Transcript - Kate Bowler Everything Happens with Kate Bowler Kelly Corrigan: Tell Me More 30 00:00:00 30 Read more about this episode, and get show notes, here. Both Kate and Kelly are remarkable women and in tandem they make for great listening. We were living in Damascus, Syria, and whenever one of us asked for something Mom and Dad couldnt afford, Dad would say Allah Kareem. In Arabic, Allah means God. Surely, my friend, my lost and lovely friend, called for new words. Kelly Corrigan Wonders listeners will be familiar with Alexs story as we shared it in the episode A Mother Son Story of the Ultimate Transition and it was also replayed it in the For the Good of the Order feed. Im so glad youve been plugging in and hope to keep hearing your feedback! Mom, we cant sell family, right? I looked at this sweet-natured adorable little puppy and acquiesced. When I read that, I just kept thinking of how scared Ive been about what I call being a zombie. twist handle waste valve,
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